Awoken Wadatsumi

if only he was all types at once, was all 5 colors, and also dealt damage when matching hearts.

I if only all his stats were all ∞

if only his awakenings were each 10,000 elemental damage reductions for each color, and also 5,000 auto recovery, and 5 skill lock binds resists, and 2 bind resists, and 5 dark resistances, and 5 jammer resistances, and 5 poison resistances, and 100 skill boosts, and 100 extend times.

If only his leader skill was, "You are always immune to damage"

If only his active was on a 1 turn cool down, and said "Win game"

If only putting him in your team would restore your stamina, and give you 1,000,000 magic stones. And also a tamadra, because why not?

But he doesn't. so deal with it.

If only he was a wood...

If anything he should be dragon.

it does sorta depend on what you're other monsters are. Hera ur's stats are much better than king baddies, so it still might be worth it too keep her in.

I lack Rhonia, so my devil team leads with Hera Ur. My subs are Shiva, Haku, Vampire, and Baddie.

As Zclif said, you want around 6 rows to make it worthwhile, although i think 4 is the bare minimum for it to be better than just a 2 combo (I row of 6 orbs with 4 row enhances is slightly better than a 2 combo with 2 sets of 3 orbs.)

For Ronia, you need mostly rem only things to make it work. Focusing on Dark rows and dark damage is best, but for fire you have a few options too. The ulti evo of ifrit, Flame twin star Ifrit (Late Bloomer Series) has 2 fire rows, semi decent stats, and has a sorta decent skill that can be skilled up. Dark Shiva has 2 fire rows, decent stats, and an okay skill. Belial's ult evo, Surging Demon Lord Belial has 2 rows, great stats, and a skill that converts green to red.

Some other red options are, Elemental of Harsh Flames Shiatan who has bad stats, only 1 row, and a very situation skill. he is R/R though. Beast rider Wiz Merlin has 1 fire, and 1 blue row, okay stats, and does convert hearts into fire. but he's primary blue. There just aren't that many red devils in the first place. Although, you do have the new hera ur ulti whenever that comes out.

On dark, you have a lot more options.

Either Version of hades gives you 1 row, gravity can be skilled up, and who knows what will hapen to him with his ultimate awakening evo when that comes out. Lu bu grants 1 row, but can also replace king Baddie. D/L lilith grants 1 and her active can help boost devil damage somewhat. Batman with gloves has solid stats, grant 1 black row, and a bunch of other awakenings, and has a delay skill. Batman with stealth has one row plus others, boost dark damage as an active, and has decent stats. Gryps Rider Vector Finn grants 1 dark row, has okay stats, and turns light into dark orbs.

But your best options are, Dark archdemon Lucifer who has 2 rows, has good stats, and whose active can be skilled up and also enhances dark orbs. Loki who has 2 rows, whose active boosts dark damage, and who has good stats. And D/D haku who again, has 2 ros, good stats, and whose active is kinda like ronia's.

Basically, you want tons of Row enhances of the same type, dark being the most common since nothing is strong against it.

Sadly friend, your argument is flawed.

This is what i said...

"its' one thing to be like, the active skill has too long of a cool down for too little of an effect, or the attack is just too low to use this monster, or this leader skill doesn't make sense. That's all constructive criticism. people air that opinion so others can see it and make informed decisions about the monster, or so that others can correct you in some way and point out how the monster is good despite what you think.

but when people go, "I wish this monster was something completely different" you're not offering an insight full opinion, your essentially saying. "This monster would be better in my team if he did this instead." And that's pointless."


And this is what you said...

"Your argument is flawed. I don't see how a type change is any more drastic than changing the leader skill or active skill of a monster. Aren't we also saying "This monster would be better in my team if he did this" if we complain about their skill cooldown or stats or awakenings or whatever?"



When i say, "the active skill has too long of a cool down for too little of an effect" The implied meaning is, this monsters active isn't worth it.

A monster has a cost, and the cost comes in the form of how difficult and how many resources are expended on acquiring it and leveling, it's actual team cost, and the fact that it's taking up one of your 5 team slots.

The slot is the important part.

When someone goes, this monsters skill isn't good enough, or it's cool down is too long, they're saying, this monster is not worth using because of that poor skill. Otherwise, the monster could be used, if the skill was better.

When someone says, i wish this monster was red, or a devil type, what they're saying is, i have a red team, and this monster would fit in really well with that team, or, i have a devil team and this monster would fit in well with it.

Comments such as, a 2.5X leader skill with no other effects just isn't useful, Lakshmi's active is no good, orb enhance actives just aren't good, are all constructive. They may be wrong, but their still attempts at being constructive.

comments like, Echidna should be dark, Lucifer should go a devil, and the like, aren't constructive at all. They're just a wish to make things better for yourself.

To make an analogy, critiquing the skills or stats of a monster is akin to looking at a computer and going, the processor is too slow, or the storage is not large enough. Or looking at a car and going, this has doesn't have enough horse power to tow things, or this lacks a radio and air conditioning.

Complaining about type and color is the equivalent of going, This computer should be a mac, i wish this car was actually a boat.


Again, just to reiterate. The important thing is whether or not the comment means something of value. people want to know if a monster is worth getting, worth leveling and evoing, and worth using. A comment like, "wow, that's a useless active skill." lets people know that you think the active is bad, which basically means that, No, he's not worth using. A comment of, if only he were an attacker, means nothing.

You are correct.

A monster could be ideal in a certain role, but not be the right type or color. A Red/Blue high attack monster with 2 TPA and an active that boosts god type attack fro turn would be great on an Athena, but it's colors are off.

Pointing out that it makes a bad Athena team addition isn't helpful, because that fact should be obvious. Saying you wish it was Yellow Green ins't adding anything either, you're just looking at something and wishing it was something entirely different.

Take Wadatsumi here.

People want to know, is he worth it? and if he is, why? If he isn't, why? Are their some circumstances he is worthwhile? Could he be a viable alternative for someone who doens't have something better?

Saying that you wish he was physical type, does not answer any of those questions. A super quick glance tells me he's a god balanced type, so i conclude he would be a super poor addition to my physical team, specifically a blue sonia team, because i think that's what the original comment was referring to.

We know he's a bad addition to a physical team at a glance, just like he's a bad addition to a green team, a devil team, a TPA team, and many others.

We want to know, is there a workable blue balanced team that he can fit on? what about just a plain blue team?

How about simply, if i have an opening in my blue team, could you fill that hole?

First of all, I just want you to know that after reading your replies, I now pretty much agree with what you're trying to say.

Second of all, may I just say that it's nice to finally have an intelligent and polite conversation with someone on this site. Nowadays I see a lot of negativity in the comments, and it's really irritating. For example, recently I got into an argument with someone on the uvo Durga page, and this guy I was arguing against was rude as hell (granted, I did say some pretty stupid things, but still). Kudos to you for keeping these comments civilized and polite.

:)

I aim to please.

that said, further up on this comment, i did say i went over board because this was a pet peeve of mine, so i may have been a bit too harsh. Adn with that said, i do think my point is valid though.

Also, i'm glad you didn't just down vote me and be done, i do prefer discussion, and if things work out, thene everyone leaves with a new level of insight.

dont take out all your frustrations at the guy, hes entitled to have a opinion about a card. especially in relation to team the options or lack there of. dont act like some comment god.

If only if only about if only

That is a legitimate complaint and one that irks me to no end. Bonia, unlike her sisters, doesn't (at this point in time) have a complementary dual orb enhancer of the same type. They made specific descended dungeons for Hera- Ur (staple for Ronia team) and Dragon Zombie (staple for Gronia team). The closest you can get is Kraken, but he is only water enhancement. Gungho *please* correct this injustice.

my bonia cries out in despair :(

yeah, probably went a bit overboard. but people asking for radical overalls of monsters is a pet peeve of mine.

its' one thing to be like, the active skill has too long of a cool down for too little of an effect, or the attack is just too low to use this monster, or this leader skill doesn't make sense. That's all constructive criticism. people air that opinion so others can see it and make informed decisions about the monster, or so that others can correct you in some way and point out how the monster is good despite what you think.

but when people go, "I wish this monster was something completely different" you're not offering an insight full opinion, your essentially saying. "This monster would be better in my team if he did this instead." And that's pointless.

also, why is the enter key not putting lines in anymore?

Lex and silveus are having one of the most intelligent conversations I have seen on this site. Kudos to you lex and silveus.

None of the Sonia's should be using any orb enhancing monsters, as they are terrible for their playstyle. Slimes and Rows are all they need.

If only he was a red attacker :P

If only...

Ahh i see. People are just posting whatever though. They're not really being serious or informative, but just saying stuff to say. Personally I like to make fun of them in good taste ;)

yeah, it just irks me a bit because i use this site to gather info on what i should be trying to grab for my teams.

if the general consensus is that the monster isn't great, and it looks like the dungeon is hard, i'll skip it.

so seeing a bunch of people listing a bunch of things they wish the monster did, made me initially believe he wasn't worth it. then i see it's a bunch of people basically creating a wish list of ideal monsters they want, and i have to reassess.

in this guys case, he is useless to me, my balanced team is mono green, and my blue team is physical. the only other team i use with blue in it is haku, but i'd put enchida in that team over this guy, and also, i stick to only devils for that team too.

Edit. Why is the enter key still not working? i need to come back to edit and manually put them in again.

blonia has beelzebub i believe

If only his active & leader skills didn't stink. But hey, at least there's another farmable water god (my wish has been granted), and I do love me some row enhance.

Well this guy went a little over board.
Take it easy bud.

He is perfect for an Andromeda and Sarasvati teams, better than Kraken with a life saving delay, even if the CD is longer. He is also God type which is having a big surge.

Hey, With new Loki Ult coming, This is pretty cool

H20☆FeX , can you please explain why the row enhances are not valuable to the Sonia teams. When you pair them with a slime you get, if my calculations are correct, up to a 8.4x boost in addition to the 6.25 from two sonias, and you still have the row enhances. How does that not play well? And what is a stronger playing style?


EDIT: Just as a point of clarity, since written text is so good at conveying emotion :) I am seriously curious about this as a means of improving how I play. I currently use a Ronia team with Hera-ur and King Baddie as my primary boss spike play. But if there are better ways to play (adding another Ronia, D/L Lilith for the row enhance as opposed to the extra 3x burst I would love advice) Cheers

i don't have ronia, so i can't say for 100%, but i'm pretty sure what you want is just more row enhances. and orb enhance, like Hera-ur, ends up being less effective than just another King Baddie.

You shouldn't need both a orb enhance and a king baddie in the same turn, assuming you're also using Ronia's active. her active, plus the baddie, plus a pile of row enhances should kill everything. If say, there was a powerful sub boss, you'd most likly be better off with a second Baddie.

And in the event that there is something that survives that bust of damage, there are likly better ways of dealing with that situation than having Hera-ur. A delay, or being able tot ank the hit somehow.

Fianlly, someone probably did the math, but i didn't so i can''t say for sure. but it's possible that two more row enhances will deal greater damage than having the orb enhance anyways.

He said Sonia should not use ORB enhance. He stated that Rows and slimes are all you need. So your question is moot.

But in the since of answering your question, if it indeed meant to ask why Sonias should not use ORBs, then I would suggest googling Row vs. Orb enhance. There has been countless detailed analysis of these enhances. Also, it depends on the amount of Row enhances a team has. 6+ it generally ideal for one to go out of their way to make rows rather than as many combos as possible with +s. He is just simply stating that, on a Sonia team, with the correct number of Row enhances and a slime, you will not need a Orb enhance character, as this would be complete overkill.

Thanks, Silveus, for the helpful response. It helps me to get an understanding of the logic behind some of the strategy. Hopefully it will help me improve as a player and will become better at building teams. I can see the value in adding some stronger more useful awoken skills compared to what I had assumed was just a more damage must be better. Thanks again! Might be time to get another King Baddie.

Thanks again guys. I guess I have been playing the overkill card. I really appreciate the lengthy detailed response. I need to take a step back and look at this from another perspective. I have been having a few issues clearing some of the Blue descends, so focusing on the Dark row enhance might help me get to those bosses. Thanks again silvius for all of the monster references and thanks Zclif for the updated response. I will look at some of the posts with the mathematics behind it. The statement of it being overkill was what I was missing to help me polish my teams. Cheers all

Just sub Hadar instead of Hera-Ur and you get the best of both worlds! Dark orb enhance, dark row enhance, and great stats!

wasn't*

Your argument is flawed. I don't see how a type change is any more drastic than changing the leader skill or active skill of a monster. Aren't we also saying "This monster would be better in my team if he did this" if we complain about their skill cooldown or stats or awakenings or whatever?

Fair enough, but I still think pointing out that a monsters attribute or type isn't very good can be constructive as well. You said yourself that people can comment on how maybe the active skill cooldown isn't the best or whatever, and that allows people to point out maybe what advantages the monster does in fact have. I feel like even though people are complaining about how a monsters type should be something else or whatever, it's also an indication that they are not happy with the current type or attribute the monster has, which can also open up conversation about how beneficial the type and attribute it DOES have can be

/makes Googley eyes at Silveus. "If only... He would be... Perfect!"

This is the only thing that's made me laugh today.

i choked when i read "and also dealt damage when matching hearts".
YOU FORESAW JUGGLER
OMFG

He is now.
www.puzzledragonx.com/en/monster.asp?n=3001

My favorite is when people post something to the effect of "Why does the artwork look like that - it could be better!" or "Is this a boy or a girl!?" or "Did you know that in mythology Wadatsumi was a water deity who..."

Silveus thanks for typing what I've been thinking for a long time!

But for real though if he/she/it was a physical sub that turned dark orbs to blue and then enhanced blue AND delayed one turn...

Also, when is she/him/her gonna get an ultimate!?

You mad bro?

I'd say comparatively, Kraken and Wadatsumi are on par with each other. One round delay isn't that great (especially 23 cd for a god), Krakens active cd is easier to max skill (& lower, though no delay). Wadatsumi has decent RCV, Kraken has negative. Their leader skills are about equal, which means they're not really useful to anyone who can clear legend dungeons. Awoken skills are equal.

Unless you already have Kraken.

Kraken doesn't have that sweet sweet delay.

He´s on the Decend carnival, I got him on my first clear and actually thought he´s just another garbage decent goody to go with some other useless stuff and a neat main drop (which is Kaguya Hime, who I need to get my awoken Amaterasu...). Still dunno in what way it could be usefull (although I do have Andromeda), will keep until useful I guess

except u can get kracken via PEM. This guy, thru a hard decend

Except the Heroes thrive on Rows and small clumps, so orb enhance is pointless...

Capes don't generally come off your head.

that's not a cape. that's his pet trying to look like a cape (see his previous evo + the red eye in this one)

he is now

SQ is better but at least this one is farmable

Sun Quan can't cover multiple colors.

For that matter, SQ is way better...

The irony we have now....

He can now :-p

Better than SQ if/when U&Y gets his balanced UVO.

Gungho wants you to stone to skill him up is why!